With her natural loftiness accentuated by a pair of high heels, Leizel van der Westhuizen, MC, public speaker, radio and TV presenter, and entrepreneur, was hard to miss at the high-society party.
But when a newspaper columnist called her a “giraffe” in his report, she was hurt at first, having been teased for her tallness while growing up, and up, and up.
Then Liezel had an epiphany that would forever change her outlook on life, and take her career to ever greater heights. She embraced the label, and turned it into a personal brand, with an elegantly willowy giraffe serving as the “L” in her corporate logo.
Today Liezel, whose presenting showcases include Idols, Supersport, and SABC3’s daily breakfast show, Expresso, is sharing what she has learned about personality and branding through her Giraffe Brand Academy, which helps individuals to “elevate their career or business” by building their personal brand.
As Liezel tells Ruda Landman in this candid interview, that begins with finding the “things that make you unique, authentic, and real”, which in Lieze’s case ranges from prize-winning speaking skills to her mountain-biking adventures to her charity work with young learners in Khayelitsha.
Watch the interview to learn more about Liezel’s rise to fame, and her tips for standing out in the crowd.
Transcription of Ruda Talks Change with Liezel van der Westhuizen
Ruda Landman: Hello and welcome to another conversation about change, about life, about choices we make and choices which, very often, are forced upon us. And my guest, my, my sharer in the conversation, Liezel van der Westhuizen. So happy to have you here.
Liezel van der Westhuizen: Great to be here, thank you so much.
RL: Ja. You work in radio, television, you do MC work all over the world, you now have a brand…
LvdW: Building company. Yeah, yeah.
RL: Brand building and training people, and awareness of…we’ll, we’ll talk about that.
LvdW: So much to talk about.
RL: Ja. And the, the whole social media presence, etcetera, etcetera. But all of this is, if you were, if you look back to when you were 15, 16, this didn’t look like the possible future.
LvdW: Not at all.
RL: Too tall, too tall, too early, shy, couldn’t speak in front of people.
LvdW: Too skinny, my name was being teased, I, I grew up in Pretoria North and I went to an all girls school, I was teased about where I grew up and where I live. And, but, you learn to live with that. That’s just a thing, and, and it actually helped me later on in life to realize that the things and the things you were teased about at school and the workplace, it’s different things you’re teased about, you just get a little bit stronger. And, you learn to laugh it off. And of course I’ve got a great support base.
RL: But you, there was a, there was another possibility, and that is that you could’ve just withdrawn and, and become a typist. Or something.
LvdW: Yes. Yes. Or done something completely different, being behind the scenes and not being in front of the scenes.
RL: Ja. How did you, how did you manage? Because I was also very uncomfortable in front of audiences as, as a school girl…
LvdW: The worst. Worst.
RL: Refused to talk at debating societies etcetera, etcetera. How did you overcome that?
LvdW: It was actually…
RL: You’re very active in Toastmasters, was that part of it?
LvdW: I was, that was it. It was exactly that. And, and I’m very proud to talk about it. And one thing I’m sad, is since I’ve come to Cape Town I haven’t had a chance to, to re-ignite my Toastmasters and I’d really love to, that’s something I’d love to work on. But I was in my Honours year and I remember standing in front of the classroom to present, in your Honours year you present some of your work, and really nervous in the group environment. And I thought, you know, I could sit and try and get through this or I could find assistance. And it just happened to be, I picked up the Pretoria News at the time and they have a arts and culture section. And, I don’t know if they still do it, but I, I paged and there’s a big full page of all the Toastmasters clubs in, in Pretoria. So I thought, you know, this is perfect, let me find one, and I read the few of the profiles, what the, what they were about – some were aimed at more corporates, some were within companies and I found Pretoria East Toastmasters. And I called them up and I said I’d like to join and the gentleman, Van der Spuy, I still remember this, picked up the phone, and he was the first person that greeted me in the door. But when I arrived at Toastmasters I first sat in the car for half an hour, I didn’t have the courage to walk into the room. And, and once I was in there, it felt as if I was home. And as if, this is the place where I know that I can grow as a speaker. And I didn’t realize it was gonna lead to where I am today.
RL: But, how did you, because I would be… Let me start that sentence a different way: One assumes that Toastmasters is a club of people who love, love speaking and to do it really well.
LvdW: But it is. But they also know the fear that you face, of, of public speaking. I mean, isn’t it the number one or number two fear in, in the world, the biggest phobia? And they actually have a committee called, PR, and the, I think it’s still called that. And that’s the person that – or new membership welcomer – that’s the person that stands at the door and sees who is straggling in the parking lot, like I was, getting out the car, getting back in the car, getting out the car, getting back in and going this is not for me. And they actually do that. Their job is to make you feel welcome. And not once in my whole experience did I ever feel that I wasn’t good enough as a speaker, that I didn’t know what I was doing, and, and that was the whole premise around Toastmasters.
RL: So what is the key?
LvdW: If you…
RL: What if you have to walk up onto the stage now, how do you handle – because I’m sure you still feel…
LvdW: Yes. It’s all about preparation. I know if I’ve gotta go speak on a stage I’m not gonna come unprepared. And Toastmasters teaches you that. The other thing they teach you is to keep within your time limit. So if you’re speaking for three minutes, five minutes, fifteen minutes, they train you to do those long or short speeches. So you actually know how to work your time. ‘Cause often, I’m sure you’ve, you’ve attended meetings or, or talks where the speaker is supposed to speak for ten minutes, he’s on stage for 90 minutes. So it’s, it’s about knowing your timing and, and knowing your, and about, just knowing your talk. You don’t have to be the world’s best speaker, just know what you’re gonna say when you’re on stage.
RL: Ja. Churchill said he was making a long speech because he didn’t have time to prepare a short one.
LvdW: Yes! But that’s so true, and I realized that in Toastmasters; I knew what he was saying then, yes.
RL: You started studying communications at Tuks. What was the idea?
LvdW: So the idea was actually human resources, ’cause I love being with people and I thought this would be a perfect degree for me to, to deal with people, I never thought TV would be in my, my field, so it wasn’t anything that I’d ever thought of. And, in my Honours year, I was sitting in the human resources lecture in Honours, first week – and I was the girl with the long crazy hair, crazy tie-dyed skirt that my mom had worn and my gran had worn, and I looked like an arts student. And, and a lot of people confused me for this crazy arts student, ’cause I was really different in the way I dressed. And the lecturer turned to me and he went: First of all, Liezel, you’re the one that keeps asking all these questions about HR, you look like an arts student, there is no future for women in human resources management, and you’re actually wasting your time in my course. And I though, I got a half bursary to be here, I didn’t stand up and say anything, and I thought I don’t actually want to study human resources anymore if this is the, the way you’re treated as a woman – I mean this was a good ten, twelve years ago, and, fifteen, longer, years ago. And it kind of hit me, that, I can hear now my voice is starting to…do I actually want to fight in a man’s world for, for human resources, or is this something I don’t want to do? And I actually enjoyed communications more and I, I went to the communications department and I said: I might be too late, is there still space for, for me to study Honours? And the lecturer said: Yes, I remember you from the class, love your creative spirit, come and join us. And…
RL: Bit of a different approach.
LvdW: Very different approach. And had the approach been, I mean, I could have stood up for myself and I could have stayed in, in human resources, but it actually wasn’t for me. Communications and, and doing my master’s in communications was the best thing. So my path changed there, I changed it without knowing that was the right path for me. So he was meant to say that. And as much as I was angry for months and years after that, looking back at it now, it was the right thing and it, it was meant, the message was meant for me.
RL: Ja, ja.
LvdW: So it wasn’t meant in, I’m sure he didn’t mean it in, well, he probably did, but, I shouldn’t have taken it that way.
RL: I think he did.
LvdW: Yeah, he did, yes, yes, ja.
RL: Tuks FM was a, was also a big moment for you.
LvdW:I, I don’t talk about this moment often, but it was in my, it was in my Honours, in my first year, and I thought, I’m studying but I need to add something to it. To, to kind of, and, looking back at it now, I started building my brand without consciously knowing it. And I saw the application forms for Tuks FM, and I though, well, let me be an entertainer, entertainment presenter, let me go for the audition, how hard can it be, it’s a voluntary organisation. And I walked in, and there were five women and a man on the panel and I was kind of overwhelmed. Now imagine the girl with the pigtails and tie-dye skirt walking in, looking completely different, not like any first-year student, and you’re trying to tell them that you want to be an entertainment journalist, but the words don’t come out. And the females were sniggering amongst each other, whispering, and I just couldn’t speak, I couldn’t even say my name. Then they asked me all these entertainment questions and I knew none of the, none of, none of the people they were talking about and I thought, ooh, I’ve really messed this up. And they went: No, sorry, you can’t be a presenter, you can’t even speak. And I think that was also my catalyst to joining Toastmasters later on. And as I got to the door and I walked out, and I said thank you for the interview – funny, I found my words there – the gentleman turned to me and he went: Actually, there’s a job as a tea girl, you can take it, but very snidely, and, and it was a joke. And I went: Sure, no problem, I’ll take it. And he went, and he said: No, no, there’s no tea girl job, we were just joking, and they were all sniggering and laughing – these are students, at a voluntary student organisation! It still shocks me to this day. But I took the job and I insisted they give it to me, and I worked my way to admin and into PR and to, to the music division in, within Tuks FM. But the funny story is, the gentleman’s name was Gareth Cliff, who I later worked on Idols with and we recounted this story and, and we had a good laugh about it. So, another moment where I, I could have done things differently and just walked out, but I, I, I then found my voice and said I’ll take the tea girl job and, and that’s how I started at Tuks. Never went onto air though, I was then still too nervous and that came later on, but it was also a changing moment in my, my career.
RL: How did the, the move to television happen?
LvdW: I, at Tuks FM I was, started working in the music division, so I was starting in admin, doing all the typing, typing in genders, and then the music manager approached me and said: can you come and assist me, I need someone who can go to the record companies and liaise with them, someone who’s got PR skills. And at that time I was studying human resources with a little bit of communication on the side and I though, this is great, I enjoy people, let me go. And every week I’d go and liaise with all the record companies, meet all the musicians, meet various people, arrange interviews and start setting that up. And it was in my, half way through my Honours year that I got an offer to work at Virgin Records as a junior publicist. So that all linked beautifully together. And while I was there, while I was at Tuks, before I got into Virgin, I saw a notice on the Tuks FM notice board asking for an announcer in Makro. And I, I remembered how nervous I was in that audition with Gareth Cliff and all the other ladies that were standing there, and I thought: Do I have it in me to be an announcer in Makro? Let me just go and try out. And I, I hid in the aisle while I was doing the audition, so they couldn’t see me, but they could hear me, and I basically leaned into the shelf and did the announcement, really shaking, and I’d written everything down. But they liked my voice and I started announcing in Makro, so I was studying as a student, working part-time, volunteering at TuksFM, and then some weekend shifts as an announcer in Makro, which also linked in later, I learned…
RL: And you learned, you learned to hear your voice and be okay with it, and, and…
LvdW: Yes. And that’s also helped the Toastmasters, ’cause I was, just joined Toastmasters through that.
RL: Yes.
LvdW: And it was, I, I started then working at, at Virgin Records, and now and then I, I’d help out at Makro. And it was only years later that I was assisting on a weekend at Makro, not even thinking about it, and the programme manager for Jacaranda FM had heard me. And a couple of days later he phoned to say: Come for an audition. And it all, everything at that stage just linked in.
RL: So actually, for the first time, someone said: I see your potential. Come.
LvdW: Yes. Yes. And then I, I was completely nervous then, knew nothing about that side of radio, and literally went in and the, the producer that was assisting was so nice. He let me retake and retake and retake and he said: Let’s stay here ’til you get it right. So they heard the best side, they didn’t hear that nervous side. And, and I started doing late nights at, at Jacaranda – two to six in the morning, as one starts out, on weekends. And I, I just took it with two hands and I didn’t complain, it was something that I’d started yearning for now that I was in the music industry and I, I was learning to be more confident in myself. And, ja, it all worked out the way it was meant to.
RL: And the Idols presentation?
LvdW: So, I, I was at Jacaranda and we were doing a photo shoot, and the makeup artist said to me: Do you have an agent? And I said: No, I don’t have an agent. She said: You know, Liezel, I had so much fun working with you, let me introduce you to a friend of mine, he’s an agent. I’ve just done your face, you look amazing, go and see him straight after this photo shoot. And I thought, okay, that’s, let me go, I’m, not often you have a full face of makeup on and you get an opportunity to meet an agent. And, I went, and we started doing various auditions and, I’d audition for a lot of things. I’d audition for Egoli, 7de Laan, you can name it, there was shows that I auditioned for and I got nothing. And Idols only came after I was on SABC as a continuity presenter. And I’d heard that they were auditioning for Idols and they, I, I, said do you think I’d get an opportunity, and he said, you know, you might, but I knew that it was a very male-dominated, Idols had always been male presenters, so the chances of, of a female presenter is quite slim. And they sent the script, and I never got it, for some reason I never got the script, and I phoned the agent the next morning, I said I’m on the way, the script hasn’t come through, and he said, but I’ve sent it – it ended up in the junk folder. And I was sitting in the audition green room, where you sit behind the stage and wait, and they said, did you see the script? And I went: Do you perhaps have a hard copy that I could just glance over? And I thought I had nothing to lose by just going and glancing over it and making it my own. And I also had this idea in my head that they might not see me for Idols, but you never know who’s watching and who you’re auditioning for. So it might be for Idols, but there might be another opportunity. So I kind of went with, let me have fun, let me be myself, and hadn’t watched Idols, the, the first or second season at the time, so I wasn’t too sure how the format worked, I knew a few of the things. And I just went in there and I just had fun with the audition, with no pressure on myself. And I think that’s…
RL: That’s a completely different approach.
LvdW: Yeah, that’s a different approach. Yes.
RL: Ja.
LvdW: And I didn’t have that pressure of going I want it. In the back of my head I, I thought they’ll, they’ll probably give it to a guy, but let me just have fun. And the fun element is, is kind of what set me aside and, and made me eventually get the role.
RL: But then you left in the second season, in the middle of your second season, to come and do Expresso.
LvdW: Yes. Yes. And opportunity
RL: That’s quite a thing.
LvdW: It is a thing. It is a big thing. And it was a big risk that I took. And there were times where I was…
RL: What, why made you, did you make that decision? Why not finish the, the season?
LvdW: I wanted to finish the season and they wouldn’t allow me to, they wanted, S, SABC was putting on the pressure, Idols was putting on the pressure, because obviously it’s competing channels, they can’t have the same presenters. And, I thought, you know, I, to be on a breakfast TV show in, in South Africa is a great opportunity, I mean, let me take it with both hands. It was a very hard decision, and it’s not a decision I regret, it’s a, I wish I’d been able to finish Idols, I mean I only had like four more weeks left, so I could finish and see it through. So that’s the one thing, if I had to regret anything, was not being able to. But on the other hand, SABC was putting this pressure, going: Well, if you don’t take it, we’ll give it to someone else. And I thought: Idols ends now, I don’t know if there’s gonna be another season of Idols, what do I do? I need to look after myself and my career. So it was, it was a difficult time for me.
RL: And, and had you by then decided that this was your career now? You were going to be a, a, a radio and television person.
LvdW: Yes. Ja, then I knew, because Idols is seasonal, and I knew being on, on, on TV every day now at least I know that I, I’ve got, I’m, I’m…
RL: You’ve got a salary!
LvdW: I’ve got a salary! Ja. And, so I, I, I thought that’s the career. But I’ve always been on the impression that, through Idols and through radio, I, I’d freelance. So, you don’t always, work, you don’t, it’s seasonal. So I’ve always had either radio in the background or TV or, or something else that I could, PR, freelancing as a publicist or, or doing PR. So I’ve always held three or four jobs at a time – or announcing in Makro. So, whatever it is, I always had one or two fingers in the pie somewhere. So I knew it wasn’t only gonna be TV, I’d have to find something else, maybe at Makro, or something else in, in Cape Town.
RL: That is such an important thing for a person like both of us, working in a freelance environment…
LvdW: (So hard!)
RL: When Deon Opperman started Afda, I remember reading somewhere that he said to his students you need to have five different things on the go all the time, because they will come and go.
LvdW: It is. And you need to learn, you need to learn different skills. So, it might not just be about presenting, you need to know what’s happening behind the scenes. Or something else, another, another source or, or income stream. And it had always been, because I’d been working at campus radio, I’d been studying and I’d been at Makro, I’ve always had, juggled a few things and been able to manage that. I think it just stood me in good stead through, through everything.
RL: And I think that is so important, to say to people who want to enter the industry, it is never going to be just plain sailing.
LvdW: No.
RL: It’s, you’re not gonna get, it’s not the same as working in an office and going to the…
LvdW:And knowing you’ve got a medical aid and at the end of the month you’re getting x, and you can pay your car off and you can pay your phone off and…
RL: Yes. Yes. But it can work.
LvdW: It can. But it’s also about being clever and knowing, managing your money. Which, I have a big thing about this, we need to train more. And I know you, we already had this conversation as well, youngsters, about knowing how to save, knowing how, cause you get, for six months you earn, then for six months you don’t earn as a freelancer, or three months. So you know that these, this six months has to last you for a year, and not just six months. So it does get hard. And, and it’s, everyone thinks it’s really big money that you’re making on TV and you’re able to buy all these great things, and it’s not always the case. And, and it, it, you only, your contract’s only from month to month, or six months, and you need to know that, that you’ve got something in the background, that you can kind of fall back on.
RL: In the mean time you also did a master’s degree in…
LvdW: Communications management.
RL: Communications management.
LvdW: Yes.
RL: Why? Why keep studying?
LvdW: I, the reason was, and it’s, no-one must judge me on this, I’d gotten half my scholarship back – they said if you study your honours, your master’s, I think they were going through a, the university might have been looking for students for the master’s programme, and because of my marks I got 50% off my fee. And I thought, well, to be able to afford to go and study and get 50% off, let me just do it. So it was kind of a, the opportunity’s here.
RL: It’s available.
LvdW: And, and I’ve been wanting to do a doctorate to follow up on that, it’s been something in the back of my head, but the, the whole fees and the costs and stuff is, is always been the thing. So, and that’s why I did my master’s, ’cause it was just that opportunity at the right time. And I love the fact that I have that.
RL: It is a really difficult academic discipline to do post-grad studies.
LvdW: Post-grad and working full-time, and…
RL: Yes.
LvdW: It is, it is very hard.
RL: So is there a part of you that is a studious, academic, focused person?
LvdW: I don’t, I never see myself , and I’m, I’m busy studying at the moment because I’m, I’m studying for a skipper’s licence. My, and, I’ve been doing exams, we’ve gotta do chart work and math work and work out all these calculations. And I mean the last time I studied was, was year ago, so it brought back all these memories, this pressure of going: What if I fail my chart work exam? And, and then I think to myself, what is the pressure we’re placing on, on students? What pressure do we place on, on ourselves at matric level, to pass? And pass at, at varsity, and, and it’s hell to pass and it’s okay to fail. And it’s okay not to be the, the A-student. So I, I look back at that and I went: How did I ever cope through all of that? How did I have the strength?
RL: Yes. Yes…
LvdW: I was so young to, to work full-time and study. And I was in a group of, of the students were much older, they were all working. I’d come straight out of Tuks FM, I’d just, I mean the music industry is creative, it’s not a corporate world, it’s not, it was never seen as a real career – even the students that were, were studying with me said: But it doesn’t count, it’s not a real, it’s not a real job, being in the music industry. So, ja, so it’s, it’s, it’s interesting how I did that, I don’t know how. And, and I was lucky enough at, at Virgin and EMI Music, they, they’d given me some study days and leave days to be able to do that. So, because it was communications and it fell in with PR. So it kind of went hand in hand.
RL: Still. Well done.
LvdW: Thank you.
RL: And now you’re into something, which is it, a kind of, it’s almost as if it’s morphed. You know, the whole social media presence and now with that goes your brand building, you have a brand building academy.
LvdW: Yes. Yes. That’s also started as, it’s funny how things in your life work out and only when you sit back, and I’m sitting here with you thinking back on how it all happened.
RL: Ja.
LvdW: In 2010, Craig Jacobs had an, a, an article, it was a photo of my sister and myself at an event and we looked really tall, we had super high heels on we’re, we’re, we’re a really tall family, and they wrote: “The giraffe sisters were there”. There was a photo of us and I thought that’s quite an insult. And I remember hiding that from my sister Monique and going I don’t wanna show her, ’cause I know what it was like growing up…
RL: Did it feel hurtful?
LvdW: It did feel hurtful. And we grew up being teased about our height and, and, and I remember trying to protect her, not showing her the article, and she heard from someone we were there in the paper, and she phoned and she said: What did they say? And I said: Oh, you’re not gonna like this. They said we looked like giraffes. And she went quiet and I thought she’s probably crying or trying to hold back tears. And, instead her reaction was: Yes! We have a nickname in the media. And I thought, wow, she’s actually right. And, and my sister’s always been the person, whenever there’s something negative written about me or said about me, I, I know that I can go to her because she can twist it around and, and see the funny side. And it just started spiralling, this giraffe nickname just started spiralling about, a, a sportswear company sent me a jacket with giraffe on the back which I still have to this day. when I checked into a hotel, they’d fold the towels into a giraffe and say: Welcome, giraffe. And I didn’t realize what big pull this had. And it was only until Jen Su, she used to be a presenter on 5, she wrote in her book how I’d been called the giraffe and, and used that as my brand. And I never actually thought of it. We, we used it as a joke and as fun, and the giraffe came everywhere and where ever I went, even on my bicycle when I take part in races, there’s a giraffe in the front, and… So from that, what was meant to be a hurtful, in, in the gossip column, in the way it’s meant to be done, launched this whole personal brand that I didn’t think was gonna amount to anything. And a coach from America actually approached me and she said, could you come and talk, I’m coming to South Africa, I followed your giraffe story, can you come and train my mastermind students on personal branding? And I thought: What do I know about personal branding? This was about 4 years ago.
RL: What is personal branding!?
LvdW: And I, I know personal branding, but why are you asking me? And I, this was my reaction to her. And she said: Because you built the giraffe brand. And I went: That’s interesting. And that’s how the Giraffe Brand Academy came out – from just helping, assisting someone else on training her students on, and…
RL: So for someone who’s completely new to this whole…what does it mean? Building a personal brand?
LvdW: Well I like, I like… Well, I like comparing it to, to, we’ll start with graduates: Their, their canvas is blank, when they go and apply for a job interview, what do they have? They’ve got a blank canvas that they can work with. So it’s basically painting your, your CV with a picture of what you, you’ve actually been doing, so volunteering at a campus station or perhaps walking a dog at, at a local shelter, or working at an old age home, volunteering at beach clean-up. Adding all these things, and adding an extra element or dimension to, to just who you are. And, and it stands in good stead if you’re going to a job interview, what’s gonna set you apart? And I like to say, what’s gonna make you stick your neck out, above the rest of the candidates? So it’s the unique things that make you unique, but it’s authentic and real to you. So, for me, I love mountain biking, so I share the stories of my, my mountain biking, so people know that I, I enjoy that. So it’s adding the different elements and dimensions into, to who you are. And then, of course, it’s looking at your social media presence – what are you saying on social media? And is it relevant, is it, what is job, potential employers going to look at?
RL: And if someone looks at this in what, ten years’ time, will, will you still be okay with it?
LvdW: Yes. I mean, Trevor Noah’s a perfect example when he got the, the, the Late Night show. They looked through his, his Twitter account and they looked at every single tweet and I think four or five were flagged afterwards. For, they, they came up and I can’t remember what they were about, and they were flagged during the interview process.
RL: I remember that, ja.
LvdW: And it’s about having a brand that people can relate to and, and companies should also embrace their employees being brands, because they’re the, the biggest spokesperson for the company. If they’re embracing the brand and living the brand. There’s a, a young guy that I was working with, that works for a car manufacturer, and he works in the back end, he’s built his own social media around this really amazing car brand. Every day he posts videos, nothing to do with the company, they’ve never asked him, but now they’re started incorporating him in because he’s kind of an unofficial brand ambassador, ’cause he loves the brand so much. So it’s, it’s about understanding who you are as a person and understanding how you relate to people and then, of course, linking it all together – how you look outside, online and offline, it’s not just the online presence, the social media presence.
RL: But if you, if you are going to put yourself out there, on social media specifically, as a marketing tool, it’s almost a full-time job.
LvdW: It is, and, and, it’s, but, but it isn’t either, I mean, you don’t have to, you don’t have to Tweet all the time, you don’t have to Instagram all the time. My big, my big love is LinkedIn and, and I always say to, to, especially to graduates, use your LinkedIn profile, because that’s where a lot of the corporates look and, and a lot of the entrepreneurs are on there and building, and sharing stories. It’s a great place to connect, it’s basically one big networking pool.
LvdW: So, I, I always say, you know, post once or twice, related to the industry you’re in or related to what you, you’re working in, but you don’t really have to be on, on social media. I don’t know how everyone does it to be eight, eight hours a day being able to answer everything.
RL: Ja, ja.
LvdW: And just make it manageable for yourself, make it bite-size bits, so whether it’s one Instagram post a week and one Facebook post a week, that’s great for showcasing who you are. It’s not just going: Hey, I had porridge for breakfast, type of thing. It’s having a little bit more substance than that.
RL: And tell me something about your, you, you’ve done the Iron Man twice, you’ve done all kinds of other things – cycling, a lot of cycling. And the most interesting one, recently, tandem cycling with a, with a blind person in the Himalayas.
LvdW: Yeah. So, I got an email about eight weeks before the event from a lady and she said her, two or three of her partners that she’d asked weren’t able to assist her, would I be able to? And, and I wasn’t fit enough at the time and I phoned her and I said: I don’t know if I’m gonna be fit enough, is this a mountain biking race, and how difficult is it? And I didn’t realize what we were actually in for. And eight weeks later we left for India, got on the flight with this massive bicycle, and these two blonde, tall blonde girls – our nickname was Giraffe, the Giraffes, just by chance, we all had giraffe pyjamas and, and hoodies and stuff. And we arrived in India, two Westerners with a, a big bike, and we arrived at this cycle club called Adventures Beyond Barriers and they have an organisation that give disabled athletes the chance to experience anything – whether it’s climbing Kilo, Kili, or scuba diving or, or cycling. And there, they team up pilots, the front rider is called a pilot, on a tandem, the bicycle built for two, and then the back rider is called the stoker. So they team up pilots with stokers and we were the South African team that had come to, to take part. And it was a ten-day journey, 550 kilometers…
RL: Oooooh!
LvdW: Doesn’t sound far and it sounded doable. But it was the altitude and it was the climbing, so it was 18,500 feet above sea level on the last day. And I think the, the, Everest is 22,500 or 24,500 so that’s just to give you a comparison. And it literally was, I worked it out the other day, it was every day basically, if you had to imagine climbing up and cycling down Table Mountain four times a day, in terms of, of the steepness. But it was an amazing experience, because we, we lived in tents and it, it opened my eyes to, to what people face on a daily basis – people who are not, visionally, visionally impaired people, and, and we had people, amputees taking part. And I just saw a different side of, of life that we’re not always appreciative of. The lady that I went with had to do a shoot, she said I’ll just jump into an Uber, and I thought how, how do you call an Uber? How do you look on your phone and, and I didn’t realize that there was voice activation. Things, my, my athlete had, had 40% vision, so he had 40% vision, and the other athletes there were completely blind. So their, their, their pilots had to describe everything, every single day that you saw – what it looked like, what the forest looked like, what the rivers looked like. And, and we don’t understand fully what people with disabilities are facing in everyday lives.
RL: We take so much for granted.
LvdW: We take so much for granted, and we take the basic thing like ordering an Uber, or how does the Uber driver know who, who they’re picking up, and how do you know you’re getting in the right Uber.
RL: Car?
LvdW: And the right car. Another friend of mine works for the Guide Dogs Association. She had to assist Uber, setting up with, how to put the guide dog in and, and that’s it’s okay for, for visually impaired people to get in the Uber with, with their guide dog. So, it’s little things that we take for granted. Or getting off the right bus, crossing the road, and, and things like that. So it opened my eyes to, to that and to the scene that if, if, the fact that we’re living in tents every day, had no running water, and had to basically get up and keep going and, and be motivated. But also, at night we sat around the, the fire, and we all shared stories, different stories about our backgrounds. There was a gentleman that, that was facing cancer and he’d done this ride with his son. And it was just all these great stories that came out of there and it just made you realize that you need to be more open to what people are facing every day.
RL: And more appreciative of what we have. Ja.
LvdW: And more appreciative, yes. And, and assist more, because there’s so many and, and especially in the fitness industry, there’s so many athletes who don’t have the ability to, to have someone to, to cycle with them on a tandem. And, and I was lucky enough to do that. Next year we’re looking at, at taking some, some more athletes to do a different type of race. So, and now I’ve managed to put a group together to be able to, to do that and we wanna look at doing some races in South Africa as well, where athletes are, get that opportunity to be able to compete.
RL: Fantastic idea. You’re also involved with an NGO which works in Khayelitsha?
LvdW: Yeah, ja, with Velokhaya, and, Velokhaya Life Cycling Academy. Amazing story. They, they built this afterschool centre, just a little, a little, started with nothing basically, and kids could come after school, do homework and then get a bike and ride. And it’s now just become this, this vegetable garden and a, a beautiful homework centre with satellite to, to Europe, to trainers and, and lecturers in Europe teaching kids math and geography and all of that. And, this safe space that kids can, can get off the streets, get on their bikes, and there’s some great stories also about cyclists. One is, is Anele, a young girl that, we started cycling together when I just came to Cape Town and she made the SA team. She’s just been hit by a car, good news is she’s back on her bike, but her bike’s been destroyed and here’s this young girl from Khayelitsha, no bike, no funding, no nothing, and, and people are now reaching out ’cause they know the Velokhaya story, they know about Anele starting out as a young girl, cycling. And, and it’s stories like that, the, that’s our future cyclists there. Nick, Nicholas Dlamini, who’s in the Dimension Data team in Tour de France, that’s the academy he came out of. So it’s…
RL: So, how are you involved? What do you do?
LvdW: So I just, I do various fundraisers for them, I, I cycled a bike that was powered by social media through the Cycle Tour every tweet I got…
RL: What does that mean, powered by social media?
LvdW: Well, we, we thought we’d, we’d do something different. Every time someone tweeted about me riding, or to contribute, I would go a meter further and a meter further, and, and stuff. Luckily we got a lot of tweets and, and, and we had a lot of support. And then Pick n Pay matched my distance that I travelled with bicycles.
RL: Ooh!
LvdW: And then we donated the bicycles to, to the organisation. And then, just involved with various life skills, and assisting, and rides, and, and getting the word out there. But they’re not the only cycling academy that’s popping up, Masiphumelele has a cycling academy that’s come up. So from this, this catalyst of, of cycling academies, Songo.info in Kayamandi, Stellenbosch – they do the same thing, they have afterschool, once your homework is done and the tutors have marked it, you get a bike. So your incentive is to ride. And, and I love that it links in school with the fitness side of things, so it’s two of my, I think I’m coming back to the, the love of, of studying, I suppose. And, and the fitness side.
RL: And, personally? You were very publicly single for quite a while.
LvdW: Ja, ja.
RL: Why, why did you decide to make it public? To write about it?
LvdW: No, I, I, I think I, I was, I was tired of the dating scene in Cape Town, I’d just moved to Cape Town and break-up had happened in Cape Town, and it was quite public, everyone knew about it. And I kind of reclused a little bit about it, and I thought, you know, let me speak about what the dating scene is like and I was on K-FM Breakfast at the time and they, they said this is a great idea. Get onto the various dating apps and start dating and then we share the stories the next day on air, which made for good content – although some of the, the, the guys didn’t like that, obviously all names were changed. But you just realize that once you’re in your thirties, how hard it is in the dating scene. And I’ve seen tweets now from, from people going: I’m in my thirties and the dating scene is so hard. So, ja, we used these stories on air as, as ways to say, this is what happened, I’m not alone. And a lot of them then came back and said, you know Liezel, this happened to me, that happened to me on a date. And, and, ja, so it was more of a story that we produced on air and, and there, there were people out there that could relate to it. It wasn’t, it wasn’t a fun time, I, I enjoyed it and it made for good radio, but it was hard. When you, you know that you’re in your thirties, everyone’s putting this pressure on you, you haven’t met someone yet, and is there something wrong with you? And, and you start doubting yourself and it was all that pressure that was being put on me about finding your perfect person and your soul mate. And I don’t want people to have, to say when you’re 30 you have to get married.
RL: Ja.
LvdW: Or forty. I mean even Bonang got a tweet the other day going: Oh, Bonang, you’re in your thirties, you don’t have a boyfriend or a husband, girl, you’re just focusing on your career. I’m going, why are we saying this to people? Why aren’t we celebrating the fact that she’s got such a success, successful career? Why are we telling our, our women, on social media, that they should be married, and at what age? So I think, and it was hard for me to deal with that fact that, that I was single and I’m getting all these tweets from people: What’s wrong with you? Why are you still single? And, and, ja, I was being teased on radio about it as well, so, it was only until recently that I’ve actually started dealing with it. I hadn’t realized how much it actually affected me.
RL: Bullying is a, is a thing for you. It’s one of the, one of the topics you talk about.
LvdW: I, I do. And…
RL: And social media bullying these days, of course, is absolutely dreadful.
LvdW: I went through a stage when I was on Idols, I refused to go onto social media, because I was either teased about the way I spoke and my pronunciation, or the way I looked, or the way my hair was done, or the way they dressed me. Or my hands, I got a lot of things about my hands, ’cause I love to talk with my hands and it’s these long fingers. Someone had actually made a whole website about my hands.
RL: No!
LvdW: These old granny hands and actually replaced them with old granny hands, as they called them. And, ja! So, I, I, I started speaking up like that, but I also faced some bullying in not only the workplace when I was, I was starting in the industry and I started in various roles, but in, in the TV industry and the radio industry, behind-the-scenes bullies that, not a lot of, I see a lot of women are talking about it now but you’re not actually realizing what you’re facing. Female-on-female bullying, a male colleague just saying something snide, or that sexual remark, or talking about your weight. And I started to research a little bit more ’cause it really got to me. I stopped, I stopped tweeting, I stopped being on social media, I think I went through a year or two where I, I looked at my social media profiles now where I, I just didn’t believe in myself as Liezel. And I was really beaten down, that’s how I felt, like very low, low in my life. And it was only until I met Mike, who’s now my fiancé, he, he said to me: But this is not the same person I met years ago, ’cause he’d met me before, the way you are now, what’s changed? I’m like, what changed? Then I looked back at all the, the, the knocks you take as, as a person in the industry from the bullying on social media – whether it’s about my weight, I, I got asked the other day if I’m pregnant, ’cause I’m overweight apparently. And I, I hate people talking about weight and I have a big thing about that. And, especially to women, don’t, I hate the saying ‘women’s bodies are made in winter, summer bodies are made in winter’ – everyone has a great body all times throughout the year, stop putting pressure on us to make us look a certain way. And that’s why I started speaking about, out about it. And corporates have actually woken up about it and gone: We never realized that’s happening in our company, we never realized that, that people are being pushed around and nasty things are being said. Okay, but you’re right there, you’re seeing it.
RL: But it all happens under the surface.
LvdW: And, and in South Africa we don’t have a, a culture about talking out about bullying. America, big about it, in New Zealand they’ve got policies about bullying, and in the UK as well. And even in our schools, there’s only a pilot programme now that’s come out in the Western Cape that they’re testing out at various schools about how to deal with bullies. Our, our teachers aren’t equipped enough to deal with that and it’s not, I mean, they, they do so much in their daily lives already with, with schooling and lecturing and, and with the kids. And to add this onto it as well, but something needs to be done. We’re seeing kids, I mean, the suicide rate amongst our school learners on, on a, a yearly basis, it’s, it’s, it’s unacceptable. So we need to do more about that and we’re not all as strong, I’m lucky I had a strong network, my, my folks were very supportive whenever I’d speak about something written about me in the paper, and sister, amazing, honestly, about that or a nasty tweet. But I, you still go home, and you still cry. I remember lying in my bed crying about something that a colleague, a male colleague had said at work and I didn’t have the guts to talk out about it. And when I did talk about it, the company covered it up. So it was kind of a protection thing. And, and that was, that was the hardest. And it was only now, years later, that I spoke up about it and I said to them, why did you ever do that? And they went, but we never realized that. I’m going, but you did. So not a lot of people are talking about that, we’re not doing enough to support our, our learners, our graduates in, in terms of, of dealing with those bullies. And then it comes to the workplace and you gotta deal with it all over again. So it’s this vicious circle.
RL: But now you have a very beautiful ring.
LvdW: I do, and a lovely man.
RL: And he was the one then, who helped you.
LvdW: Yes.
RL: Tell me, how did you, how did you reconnect and what made it work this time?
LvdW: We, we, I’m, I gate crashed a party, ’cause my friend Jen Su was singing at this birthday party. And I wanted to see her sing, ’cause we never see each other, she’s based in Jo’burg and I was in Cape Town, and I didn’t know that it was his, Mike’s birthday. And I got there and I was wearing a black wig, and no-one knew who I was, even on the guest list they couldn’t find my name, but I wasn’t on the guest list. So I just said, please can I come in, I’m with so and so, and they let me in. And I ended up dancing the whole night and met him briefly, I, I, he says he remembers but I doubt that he does. And then Jen was having coffee with him months later and she said just come and meet Mike properly. And I met him, we’d gone to a launch together, and then only after a couple of months or a year, probably 18 months later, I was doing a fitness competition, Miss, Miss Bikini competition and he came to support – he’d heard about it, he’d seen on social media, we hadn’t actually stayed in touch. And he was in the front row whistling, and I’m like, I don’t want anyone to know that I’m doing this, I’ve entered under a pseudo-name, I didn’t tell the organisers, I was spray painted so dark – when my parents arrived in Cape Town they went, aren’t we here to support you on a mountain bike race? I’m like, no, no, no, I’m actually doing a fitness competition. And, and they didn’t even recognise – the, the way they spray tan you, you’re so dark. And my hair was this totally different white, white, white colour against the dark, so no-one really recognized me under the name no-one really knew. So I was quite surprised that he had seen it somewhere, and then he said, can I take you for dinner to celebrate? A week later, afterwards, and I though, ja, it’ll be fine. But I gave him a hard time for, for asking me out on a date and he said, I want you to, he was really like a proper gentleman, he said, Liezel, I, I, I’ve really, we’ve been, we’ve been watching each other for the last 18 months or two years, do you wanna be my, my girlfriend, I really think we’ve got a lot in common, both of us enjoy Iron Man, and, and mountain biking…
RL: So it was quite a formal, almost a proposal right at the beginning?
LvdW: Yes, it was! It was. And I went: No thank you, but thank you for dinner, I hadn’t eaten properly in six months ’cause I entered the fitness competition. He said, no, I’m being serious. And I said, you’re not serious. And he said, yes, I am. I said, okay, I’ll tell you what, and I took a, a napkin, a paper napkin and I, I asked the waiter for a pen and I said: If you wanna be my boyfriend, these are the criteria. And it was the most random things! And I thought, if I’m gonna test him…’cause I was so tired of dating men that, that play the field and that don’t commit in, in a, I don’t know if it’s a Cape Town thing or a South African thing, but it’s what I’ve been experiencing in Cape Town, and I thought, I don’t actually want to play…
RL: So what were the criteria?
LvdW: The things were, the things were: You can’t take another girl for coffee for the first three months and uhm, you’ve got to be exclusive to me for the first, for, exclusive – no other dating. Or if you go out at night you have to message me the last thing at night. It’s, it was the most ridiculous things that, I’d watched the movie How to Lose a Guy in Ten Days and it was all this over, you know, things that scare men away. I tried to do all of that ’cause I thought if he, if he, if he agrees to this I’m actually insulting him publicly, so this is a first and, and, he said sure, fine. And, and we’ve been together ever since. And…
RL: And did he?
LvdW: He signed! And, and there was a time that something happened and I went: No, no, no, you signed! Oh, it was, it was: you’re not allowed to go on holiday, it was the most ridiculous thing, you’re not allowed to go on holiday for three months with, with someone else and, and other friends, and I’m not included. It was really ridiculous, I mean I look at it now and I’m going, why did I ever write this? And, and, and we laugh about it now. And I, I’m so grateful I did that, ’cause I was so tired of, you go on a date, but the guy who’s, that you’re on a date with is going, oh, we must hurry up ’cause I’ve got another date. And that’s what, literally what it was like. And I thought, I don’t want to play, let me put all of this, and if he’s serious, and, and, and literally he was, he was serious. And it’s, it’s just been, I didn’t realize until my sister pointed out recently on a visit, she went: Mike is the person that builds you up and supports you on things like: “Hi Mike, I wanna go to the Himalayas in, in eight weeks’ time to do a cycle event”, “Sure, I think that’s fantastic”. Or “I’m thinking of starting a personal branding company”, “Great, how can I assist you”. And, and when he says assist, I mean, it means support, or what can I, can I help you with anything, do you need it to be paperwork or…
RL: Sho, we all need someone like that in our lives.
LvdW: Yeah. We need someone like that. And we did our first mountain bike race together. I’m, I’m not very fast, I, I part, I’m a participator, and he stayed at the back with me. And one of our first events after that, about three months later, was an Iron Man. So we were still dating and it wasn’t, it wasn’t, it was still new, and he said Liezel I wanna do this half-Iron Man distance with you. I said you can’t really do it with me. He says no, I’ll wait for you in transition and I’ll cycle three, seven metres in front of you and we’ll run together, and it’s been something we’ve done. So we’ve, we did that and we, we call that one of our first fun lifestyle dates. And, and he stayed with me. I was so slow, and he re-risked, he risked losing his race because men set off before women and, and, and different speeds, so he had ten minutes to make a cut-off and, and I had to really push on the bike to make sure that he made his cut-off. So, and, and those are things that, he never once moaned at me and told me to ride faster, he said “Liezel, I, I need to ask you a favour right now”, he was so calm through the whole thing, we were at a water point, “we really need to push this”. And, and remember, at Iron Man you, you, you’re riding a seven metre distance from each other, or nine metre distance, you’re not riding next to each other. So he was riding behind me, watching me, and shouting “go a bit faster, go a bit”, but he never lost his cool. And in situations like that the, the, the husband or the partner could really show the other side of themselves.
RL: Yes, ja.
LvdW: So I thought, well, okay, maybe this is my forever person.
RL: Ja.
LvdW: And it’s been like that ever since, and, of course, there’s been ups and downs, it’s not all roses. And, but I’m, I’m very blessed to have found my person, my…
RL: And your, your personal space? What do you want around you, what makes, what makes you buy a house, if you have one?
LvdW:We, we rent.
RL: Or, or move in? What attracts you?
LvdW: I love, and I’ve, from a young age I’ve loved the ocean. And I always wanted to live near the ocean, so the fact that I lived in Cape Town, in Greenpoint, I could smell the ocean, never mind that, I could see the ocean. That was a big thing for me, being near. And I do a lot of water sports, so stand up paddle and I surf ski and, and living in Cape Town you can do all these things – things that I never got a chance to do when I was in, growing up in Pretoria. And, so it’s, it’s all about the beach element.
RL: So you live on the beach?
LvdW: We live…
RL: Or close. Ja. Walking distance.
LvdW: Close enough to the, the, the sea to get to the promenade and to walk and to enjoy that part of things. And, I, I like being with my family, so there’s lots of photos in the house of family. And, and Mike knows this as well, so for my birthday last year he surprized me with taking me up to Joburg and my whole family, my mom, my dad, my sister and my brother-in-law were there for a weekend away in the bush. And that, that for me is, is special. So, recently he surprized with a, a visit from my sister and sending us to a spa. That’s, that’s the type of thing, so he knows that family is important to me, so it has to be homely. And then I’ve got two crazy dogs named, rescue dogs, named Luke and Leia, so they, they, they bring so much love into, into our lives. You don’t realize what a difference an animal makes until you actually have one.
RL: Ja. Plans? Dreams?
LvdW: I’m enjoying the space where I am now with, with the Giraffe Brand Academy and I’d like to see where that takes me. I’ve been invited to the States to speak at a conference in, in March, on personal branding. I’m really enjoying that space, exploring, it’s something new, it’s, it’s something different, it’s not TV, it’s not media in type, terms, of being in, in, in the spotlight, it’s something completely different. And it gives me a chance to, to assist people with, with things that, that for me it just seemed to have come easily for my, for me and for my brand. And, and I get to see sides of people’s brands that they don’t actually realize is possible. And, and ignite a side to them, and I’m enjoying that. I’m, I’m working with a, a, a trainer named Norma and she, she quit her job in, in administration, she’s a personal trainer, she wants to be a personal trainer. And we’ve set up a whole series of videos together that she’s posting every day on social media, she just got a job interview at, at one of the gyms in Cape Town. And she said to me, Liezel, it, it never would have been possible if we hadn’t spoken and you had said to me: You’ve, you’re a train, personal trainer. And, and she said she loved doing the admin ’cause it taught her the business side of things. But for her now, she’s got this opportunity.
RL: So you, you feel that you, you’ve become a catalyst, almost.
LvdW: That’s the word! Yes, I didn’t think, that’s, that’s a great word, ja. So, so I’m enjoying that and I’m enjoying seeing things that, that people don’t see in themselves. Ja. So.
RL: Good luck.
LvdW: Thank you!
RL: All of the very, very best.
LvdW: Thanks so much.
RL: It’s been such a joy talking to you.
LvdW: It’s been, been great chatting to you, thank you for having me.
RL: And, to all of you, until a next time, build your brand, and enjoy your life.
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